So something we were chanting back in year, 3 of Destiny. One was buff promise. My lord just about everybody was constantly saying that and for some reason, Bungie kind of held their ground. They never really came out in buff primaries. Instead, they continually slashed special weapons and it started with like various nerfs two shotguns. Then it went from nerf and shotguns to adjusting snipers to then just outright removing special Emma now. Naturally, this was extremely disruptive. I mean. Essentially, you just gave everyone. One hit kill weapons for nearly three years and overnight you took it away, but all of this, of course, was intentionally being done to groom us for destiny to destiny, to moved to the double primary system, it was like Mundy’s way of like looping us up right And for so long people were chanting primary buffs that I think Bungie really thought. This is what we wanted simultaneously, though they actually increased the time to kill values of all of our primary weapons inside a destiny to making the game extremely slow in comparison to destiny. 1, now fast-forward to now forsaking us come shadow.
Keep us come, go fast, updates time to kill, values have been dropped. A lot of things have changed. We’Ve seen some huge benefits in our sandbox over the past few years, but we’ve also seen some things left behind and I’m here to tell you guys we’re essentially back in another scenario where we are chanting: buff primary weapons and if you’re, not chanting that you should Be because all the issues that we talked about the weapons that really hurt us tell even the most recent video we made about broken weapons and exotics, 90 % of the things we mentioned on that list were special weapons and it’s because special weapons are so good. But it’s also because primary weapons – just ain’t cutting it not unless you want to rock a last word constantly or thorn or spare rations, or not forgotten and lunes, how or some pulse rifle and laying in the back or sit in the way way back in raqqa Scout rifle today guys, I want us to roll back real, quick and take a look at a spreadsheet back in Raza, varn, post the doctrine of passing nerf and go over what the damage values used to be for many of our other weapons, starting with our hand, Cannons so we take a look right here. We have the lingering song.
Oh yeah. I love this hand cannon underneath it. Of course, you got ill will notice the time to kill value, isn’t necessarily great there with the body shop time-to-kill value of 1.5. Now I understand there might be some deviation. There might actually be one point, oh seven seconds in one point: six, which is the equivalent of what we have inside of destiny to for our one tense, but just for comparison sakes, Judith lingering song ill-will is in the same archetype or close enough to Duke fan News loud lullaby and on paper this is where Bundy really starts to like mess with us right, because when we look at this, we go alright, essentially the same right. One second one point: oh seven seconds not much of a difference, but look at the damage values. First, up crit damage back. Indeed, one for these weapons was just slightly higher at ninety five Procrit versus what our 110s do here in destiny to which is ninety-one Procrit, but notice your body shot damage a massive increase hitting sixty four per body back inside of destiny. One, whereas here inside of Destiny, two they hit fifty per body. This, of course, results in both of these hand, cannons across two different games, still requiring three shots to kill, but one only requires one print into body, while the other one requires at least two crits in one body at least, and when I say at least any One six resilience are higher, can still survive two crits in one body inside of destiny. You see the problem here.
Yes on paper, they both look almost identical, but the lack of forgiveness is what’s so punishing and the reason why you don’t see more one tense. Now our next example, probably just as bad, is of course, our 140 all stringer DFA, better Devils, nation of beasts, kinder orchid. These are our 140 round per minute hand, cannons inside of destiny and the equivalent of that back inside of destiny, one was hand cannons. Like is Luna imago loop, Lord fixer, the difference is again another scenario where the TDK values of these weapons are identical, but notice. One takes one crit in two bodies hitting at eighty six per crit in 57 for body, while the other one here in d2 requires three crits, hitting only seventy four crit and forty-seven per body. The reason why this is an issue guys is that the game has consistently sped up mobility overall reaction in the game.
Everything has sped up and ramped up even surpassing, that of destiny. One the problem is: is these primary weapons have not kept up with that mobility, and is it extremely apparent? We just take a look here at these 140 rounds per minute, hand cannons and you notice the difference there in damage between what they used to hit back a distance one and what they hit now here in destiny. Now, granted I’m not jumping up and saying that 140s should one crit into body. But when I am asking for is that 140 should at least two crit in one body on high resilience? Guardians in one tense should definitely one crit into body, maybe on only five or six resilience in below and then everything after that to crit one body.
These are just some examples, but hand cannons. Definitely shout out to us the most, and you see some deviation there, which are 150 s as well paint ganas back inside of Destiny. One like word of crota, the Revelator water star those hand, cannons, could to crit him one body and they actually had a faster time to kill value at point eight seconds where they like, though, was the rain stat. So a lot of people just ended up using things like is luna imago Luke those hand, cannons pala drone simply because they offer so much more forgiveness. So I understand guys. We talked about TT, K, values and that’s an important value, but forgiveness is equally as important. Now, moving on to our next weapon time, let’s take a look at auto rifles, so autos kind of changed a bit right like we don’t have a non hundred round per minute, Auto inside of destiny 1 or destiny; 2 destiny. 1.
We did with a 9 under rounds per minute doctrine and passing a Theon’s epilogue unbid tree pretty sure those auto rifles either shot and 900 rounds per minute, or maybe even a thousand regardless, is fast now inside of destiny, one I’m pretty sure we didn’t have quote-unquote High impact auto rifles right that we had auto rifles that hit hard, but all of them were actually considered like on the same level as precision, auto rifles or 450s that are currently present inside of destiny. But if you had something like say, a shadow price back at destiny won or something like genesis, chain and rolled it with focus fire. This, of course, would actually throw the damage to the equivalent of like high impact, auto rifles inside of destiny. So bungees is actually just scratched that and just gave us high impact, auto rifles inside of d2, but just comparing the damage to damage just comparing things like grim, citizen, shadow price, zero day dilemma to things like horror story ringing now, prosecutor Uriel’s gift time to kill Wise they’re pretty much the same again, another scenario here where nothing really changes, and on top of that they both require six crits in two body to get the kill but notice the body shot time to kill values for our d1 auto rifles in this archetype 1.2 Seconds in comparison to 1.3 3 seconds, you see back inside of Destiny 1.
They hit 27 per crit and 21 providing 21 per body here inside of destiny to our 450, around fermentor, auto rifles things like yo-yos gift hits 26 per crit, so not much deviation there and your precision damage but 18 per body. That’S how you slash your forgiveness. Now know many of us want to jump up and say: whoa whoa shouldn’t we force people to lay in precision shots. That’S how you create skill gap. You’Re right. You are right in a perfect world where there is only primary weapons, that’s a completely logical response, but in d2, where we got all kinds of crazy special weapons, they could kill from 9 10 meters and the fact that our maps cater to that place. Style, which is even worse, you could sit there with that euros gift or that auto rifle all day long and that mom bender will still bend you over. You know, what’s so crazy about these damage values. Is that back in sign of rise of iron? Well, we in an auto rifle matter: no, these are damaged values. After all, auto rifles have been toned down tremendously, especially in comparison to what they were and you’re one of Destiny, one, and they still had more forgiveness than what we have here in d2.
Now pulse rifles, both rifles are actually in a really good spot, even in comparison to what they were back in Destiny, one pretty similar time-to-kill values and your high impacts. You still have that point 672 K value in point; seven, three for your four burst, pulse rifles or aggressives, as they’re called here in destiny too. You actually have a better time to kill value which your adaptive pulse rifles inside of d2. Then, in comparison to its counterparts inside of d1 at point nine three seconds – and this of course was after the clever dragon nerf – which to me was a really weird nerve as the TGA value for something like clever back inside a d1 before it’s nerve was actually 0.8 seconds Bundy, you just went in there chop the damage down and essentially gave it the same time to kill value as things like hawk sorceress, PDX 45, which was really awkward as though there’s supposed to be two very different archetypes of pulse rifles, but they both Have this same time to kill them, you one just took more shots than the other, really awkward.
Currently, right now, when I sit here and I compared the time-to-kill values, though, between d1 to d2, when it comes to our pulse rifles, if anything should jump out to you guys, rapid-fire pulse rifles in d2 have been sitting essentially the same damage. Values are close to what clever dragon was doing, pre nerf, which is why it still blows my mind. I don’t see more people using rapid-fire pulse rifles either way, it goes pulses, are still in a good spot. Moving on to scout rifles, scout rifles are very much the same from what they were back inside of d1 in terms of optimal time to kill values but notice. The deviation there in that body shot time to kill value. That’S what’s killed it man and I’m not saying that you should be landing body shots. Obviously, if you’re looking to get to three tap, whether you play d1 or d2 with that kick kindness or that coal advances duty or that Transfiguration or talons of the eagle, you want to land all three Chris. But it’s extremely nice that if you happen to miss a shot and land a body shot instead you’re not screwed hi. I’M back Scout rifles back inside of destiny, 11.6 time to kill value for his body, shot in comparison to a whopping two second time to kill value here inside of D.
You know how garbage that is freakin seconds. You know how long two seconds is. What is his overwatch now, let’s take a look at our precision scout rifles. Things like oxygen, tango, nameless midnight. These scout rifles have the same time to kill value optimally back inside of destiny, one but notice the body shot. Ttk value. One point three three seconds inside of d1 in comparison to one point: six, seven seconds inside of d2, and you see the deviation there in damage right, fifty-five Procrit compared to sixty one Procrit inside of d1, but even more criminal than that the body shot damage inside Of d1 was 41 damage per body compared to thirty five damage per body.
Now this is what’s killer man, and this is why you lose gunfights in those situations where you’ve got a guy, closing the gap on you with the spare rations or a mom bender, or something you’re, not trying to point those weapons out. There’S a reason why people use them if you happen to miss with these weapons, you are screwed because those body shot time to kill values are terrible, don’t worry, fellas, it gets worse. Let’S take a look at our lightweight scout rifles. 0.9. Second, optimal time to kill value, still three crit in one body but again another scenario: body shot, ttk value, not quite two seconds here inside of d2, but 1.8 seconds 1.8 in comparison to 1.5 distant star angels advocate he’s hit a whopping 57 % in 38 per Body doesn’t seem that big of a deviation from what we hit now at 54 Procrit in 31 per body, but it’s the little things, especially in that body, shot time to kill that will make all the difference. Now we haven’t even gotten to rapid-fire Scouts but yeah. They need some love too either way.
It goes. It’S very apparent that primary weapons have to be elevated, they have to – and I’ve kind of just been sitting around waiting for the primary buff to be mentioned, and it’s not the optimal time to kill values. Every time we ever talk about primaries these days to talk about buffing them, people are like. Oh, my god, I don’t wan na play, call of duty. No, that’s not it man. These bodies shot time to kill values, though, on these Scout rifles, these auto rifles. These high-impact hand cannons, there’s a reason why you don’t see anyone use them and it’s because they are so unforgiving and it’s not like they have some great benefit. When we talk about 140 round per minute hand cannons it’s not like, we can just jump up and go hey. You know what it still takes. Three crits. It has a slower time to kill value than 150 s, but it’s got a hell of a lot of range.
No, it doesn’t because they both got the same blanking nerf there to the range. So why would you use a 140 riflemen hand cannon over a 150 unless you’re using an exotic and see that’s the thing that keeps popping up? That’S the thing that Bungie kind of throws back at us. It’S like hey! Yes, these weapons are weaker, but the argument for 140 says well. Look at Ace of Spades. Ace of Spades is still good. You can’t trash 10 weapons to simply elevate one curling right now. We have entire archetypes with substantially higher time-to-kill values unless forgiveness than what we have back in destiny 1, while simultaneously playing in a game environment that is much faster, that no doesn’t have the one shot.
Killing abilities that we had back inside of destiny 1, but pure mobility is resulting in people outright getting out of situations that they have no sense getting out of. There’S no reason why come around a corner – and I point a misfit out a guy and I start blowing my load into him and I completely catch him off guard and he can just roll out of that situation. It makes no sense and had I had some higher damage there in my body shot time to kill value. I would have probably got the kill at some point. Bungie is gon na have to elevate these primary weapons sooner rather than later so guys. That is our breakdown today for primaries. We didn’t go over and I didn’t go over things like sidearms or shotguns or snipers things started to get kind of twisted toward the end of year 3 inside of destiny 1. But I wanted to touch upon the weapons that I very much enjoy playing with.
I enjoy playing wet high and backhand canons. I love a number of different auto rifles. I want to use mini Scout rifles, but it’s not just the fact that these maps aren’t catering to those play styles. It’S simply because those guys that can push the gap on you at extreme speeds can’t be stopped in time. It’S just simple math and it’s not that you’re, not a good player. It’S not that you don’t got good aim. Man you’re, just shooting a nerf gun. It’S a bunch of please please buff, these things, fellas and ladies, thank you all for coming and watching and as always slide that, like button, like your momma taught you right, [, Music, ],